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Thread: US Politics Thread, 2.0

  1. #13061
    NoirAvlaa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marlona Sky View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Marlona Sky View Post
    Trump is the first President in four decades that has not taken us into a new war or armed conflict, and you want the guy who will find a reason to go to war with any country to win?
    Why look abroad when he's openly encouraging violence at home?
    He’s been saying law and order, while the violent left runs around destroying property and murdering people. Are you even trying to keep up with what’s been going on or do you have bias eyes and ears.
    Hasn't the violent right done more voter fraud and killed more people so far? Asking for a friend.

    Also how are those Mexicans commuting voter fraud doing? They should've just put lock boxes outside of churches with ballot box signs on instead, much easier.

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    Also that didn't sound like abloo bloo to me, PM me and we can agree on a meeting spot and settle this with queensberry rules, that's a serious offer btw. I've been a member of this community since 2005 and i've never met a more toxic individual.

  2. #13062
    Movember 2011Movember 2012 Nordstern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marlona Sky View Post
    Trump is the first President in four decades that has not taken us into a new war or armed conflict, and you want the guy who will find a reason to go to war with any country to win?
    Charleston wasn't an armed conflict? Police crackdowns aren't an armed conflict? Armed militias storming government buildings isn't an armed conflict?

    Also, pretty sure Biden won't lead us to war against China. OR MAYBE HE WILL BECAUSE HE'S NOT A CHICKENHAWK CUCKSERVATIVE. In which case, we'll see just how well that overpriced military hardware our leaders assure us is "the best" actually performs!
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    WTF I hate white people now...
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  3. #13063
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    In other centrist garbage news Feinstein thanked and hugged Graham after the conclusion of the bullshit Supreme Court appointment of female Scalia. Fucking moronic, and nothing says it more clearly that her and the current leadership need a quick date with nursing homes.

  4. #13064
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Coutu View Post
    In other centrist garbage news Feinstein thanked and hugged Graham after the conclusion of the bullshit Supreme Court appointment of female Scalia. Fucking moronic, and nothing says it more clearly that her and the current leadership need a quick date with nursing homes.
    Lol...


  5. #13065
    Super Chillerator Global Moderator teds :D's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    i'm not talking about meeting in the middle

    at the moment there's about 35-40% of the voting populace in america who think everything he does is a-ok.

    now, if Biden hopefully wins you can either a) ignore these people or b) try and slowly change them to your way of thinking

    you can't ignore them, unless you want to put them against a wall. it is not a small number of people voting for trump. you need to work on small wins to get them to eventually come around to your position. go for what they see as full commie and start delivering free healthcare, breaking monopolies, full and normal womens rights, sane voting systems etc without involving them will lead to a swing back to an even more vitriolic right (hard to imagine) or worse, public unrest. if it was a statistically tiny amount of people then yeah you could just pretend they don't exist - but it isn't a tiny amount.

    so unless you want american politics to be a 4 year every wider swinging pendulum, then yeah sorry you need to get in the real world and bring people with you - however slowly - and not write them off.

  6. #13066
    Movember 2011 RazoR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    at the moment there's about 35-40% of the voting populace in america who think everything he does is a-ok.

    now, if Biden hopefully wins you can either a) ignore these people or b) try and slowly change them to your way of thinking
    So i have two questions:
    Why do you think these people approve of trump?
    How do you change them to your way of thinking?

  7. #13067
    Jack Coutu's Avatar
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    wasnt aware you need to worry about 35 percent of the population taking the majority if the democrats push through massive changes that strip minority voting supremacy away.

  8. #13068
    Super Chillerator Global Moderator teds :D's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RazoR View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    at the moment there's about 35-40% of the voting populace in america who think everything he does is a-ok.

    now, if Biden hopefully wins you can either a) ignore these people or b) try and slowly change them to your way of thinking
    So i have two questions:
    Why do you think these people approve of trump?
    How do you change them to your way of thinking?
    i think they approve of him because they feel disenfranchised, and because of a generally poor education system in the US - don't get me wrong, europe has it's fair share of morons, but nothing compared to what you see at a MAGA rally. they feel left behind by globalisation, their jobs have dried up and all they see politicians and the media talk about is things like black lives matter - not that their lives matter. so along comes some ultra orange guy saying he cares and he's a winner, and he's one of them and obviously they're going to flock to him.

    you change them by slowly slowly conditioning - hate to drop a proverb, but same as the boiling frog - you incrementally change society without them really noticing. you don't go for, for example, instantly enact free healthcare for all. you start small, and you slowly keep adding to it until there's essentially no difference between what you do, and free healthcare. most importantly, you work to take the heat out of the conversation.

  9. #13069
    Super Chillerator Global Moderator teds :D's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Coutu View Post
    wasnt aware you need to worry about 35 percent of the population taking the majority if the democrats push through massive changes that strip minority voting supremacy away.
    so you just fuck over what 35% of people feel/want and then it's cool and there's no problems after that? ok.

  10. #13070
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    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    i'm not talking about meeting in the middle

    at the moment there's about 35-40% of the voting populace in america who think everything he does is a-ok.
    no, 35-40% of the voters appear think that is okay, the US produces sub-50% voter participation on the regular meaning outsized minority representation. and the republican party, much like the tories are heavily reliant on low information "institutional" votes.

    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    now, if Biden hopefully wins you can either a) ignore these people or b) try and slowly change them to your way of thinking

    you can't ignore them, unless you want to put them against a wall.
    so you're just dependent on perpetual democrat victories in order to hopefully "convert" the "moderate" republicans over. you do realize that is word for word Biden's electoral strategy right ? you also realize how hard its failing to actually get any of the hardcore republican base right ?
    as for putting "them" against a wall, considering how strident the calls for doing the reverse is getting there is, its really a moot point by now, it's no longer a question if, but when.

    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    it is not a small number of people voting for trump.
    it's smaller than the portion of the electorate the democrats actively participate in disenfranchising.

    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    you need to work on small wins to get them to eventually come around to your position. go for what they see as full commie and start delivering free healthcare, breaking monopolies, full and normal womens rights, sane voting systems etc without involving them will lead to a swing back to an even more vitriolic right (hard to imagine) or worse, public unrest. if it was a statistically tiny amount of people then yeah you could just pretend they don't exist - but it isn't a tiny amount.
    Teds, your argument is essentially "lets do nothing, then maybe the other side is not going to murder us when they get the chance!" while they're trying to abduct governors, discussing forming what can be entirely reasonably called right wing death squads, calling for mass usage of state violence and repression against their political opponents, refusing to abide by the rules of democracy and flat out plotting a coup.

    after spending 40 years giving them concession after concession, and your solution is simply "COMPROMISE HARDER! MORE CONCESSIONS!"

    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    so unless you want american politics to be a 4 year every wider swinging pendulum, then yeah sorry you need to get in the real world and bring people with you - however slowly - and not write them off.
    what you actually should do is mobilize people around broadly popular politics, say universal healthcare access in a midst of a fucking GLOBAL PANDEMIC to point at a trivially available example and fuck the republican partisans. oh sure, they're going to behave like a bunch of piss babies and probably commit acts of domestic terrorism, like they already are on the regular but the broad appeal of the policy, assuming you're willing to back it to the hilt is going to win out.

    that, is the lesson of the years of lead, you do not meet rising fascism with meek compromise, you meet it with a raised fist and a open hand. the raised fist is because fascists only respect and fear strength, compromise is a weakness in their eyes. the open hand is the promise of a way out of the material conditions that created the growth of fascism in the first place.
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    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  11. #13071
    Super Chillerator Global Moderator teds :D's Avatar
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    christ i'm not getting into some quote rage posty thing with you so;

    i cannot say this clearer - and if you want to pretend i'm saying things i'm not and type lots of words, then cool, enjoy

    YOU WILL NOT GET BACK TO NORMAL BY PRETENDING THESE PEOPLE DONT EXIST

    so you're either;

    pretending everything is fine, until the next election which the dems will lose
    shooting them all
    or working with them

    they're the options. you can type as much as you like, but they're the options (if, and i hope, biden wins). let's try reality for a second.

  12. #13072
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    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    you don't go for, for example, instantly enact free healthcare for all. you start small, and you slowly keep adding to it until there's essentially no difference between what you do, and free healthcare. most importantly, you work to take the heat out of the conversation.
    lol im glad you know a lot about American politics

    We did exactly what you described with healthcare, the baby steps incremental ACA where we tweak private insurance to expand coverage and try to find common ground with Republicans by using their plan from the Heritage Foundation. It was fucking despised for good reason.

    Try reading about American politics for a change, I'd start with A Crisis Wasted if you want to understand why your politics is DOA in the US

  13. #13073
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    Also whats normal here has lead us to Trump, and normal was a country where I'll be dead if we go back to normal since I have preexisting conditions and am not wealthy.

    As for the 35%, if you really think reason and logic have any effect on them, try speaking to some of them. They can IMAGINE harm, but if the country wasn't run by right wing lunatics and centrists, their situation would improve. That's the only way to solve the issue. Pandering to lunatics is a losing idea. If they want to act like they've been acting, and defy a majority, they weren't born morons, they can learn. They have a choice. The minorities that don't decide to be born as such that are the ones they'd gladly wipe out or continue abusing. I really could give two fucks what some dumb fuck wants if they would gladly send this place into a pit if Trump said it was a "beautiful pit". You are speaking to people like Marlona as if they deserve a chance in governing the country. Speaking to racist trash like Lark like he'll just snap and get it one day.

    The country needs massive changes, and fast. If the morons want to cry about it and not accept it getting on track, let them, no one is forcing them to remain that way but themselves.
    Last edited by Jack Coutu; October 16 2020 at 05:37:59 AM.

  14. #13074

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marlona Sky View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Marlona Sky View Post
    Trump is the first President in four decades that has not taken us into a new war or armed conflict, and you want the guy who will find a reason to go to war with any country to win?
    Why look abroad when he's openly encouraging violence at home?
    Also how are those Mexicans commuting voter fraud doing? They should've just put lock boxes outside of churches with ballot box signs on instead, much easier.
    How does that even work? I was under impression that there was a wall at the Mexican border ...
    Last edited by Hel OWeen; October 16 2020 at 04:13:30 PM. Reason: Quotes fixed.

  15. #13075
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    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    christ i'm not getting into some quote rage posty thing with you so;

    i cannot say this clearer - and if you want to pretend i'm saying things i'm not and type lots of words, then cool, enjoy

    YOU WILL NOT GET BACK TO NORMAL BY PRETENDING THESE PEOPLE DONT EXIST

    so you're either;

    pretending everything is fine, until the next election which the dems will lose
    shooting them all
    or working with them

    they're the options. you can type as much as you like, but they're the options (if, and i hope, biden wins). let's try reality for a second.
    I already told you what needs to be done in terms of mindset, but you made some flippant dismissive remark and made like it was never said.
    Quote Originally Posted by Isyel View Post
    And btw, you're such a fucking asshole it genuinely amazes me on a regular basis how you manage to function.

  16. #13076
    Malcanis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    you don't go for, for example, instantly enact free healthcare for all. you start small, and you slowly keep adding to it until there's essentially no difference between what you do, and free healthcare. most importantly, you work to take the heat out of the conversation.
    lol im glad you know a lot about American politics

    We did exactly what you described with healthcare, the baby steps incremental ACA where we tweak private insurance to expand coverage and try to find common ground with Republicans by using their plan from the Heritage Foundation. It was fucking despised for good reason.

    Try reading about American politics for a change, I'd start with A Crisis Wasted if you want to understand why your politics is DOA in the US
    White boomers and other fascists will never accept "healthcare for all" unless it excludes niggers, wetbacks, perverts, immigrants, freaks, "millenials" and other untermensch. They have both plainly said and repeatedly demonstrated that they'd rather die themselves than let the government provide support for the above mentioned.

    'Centrism' in US terms is "democratic socialism for the white right, oligarchal syndicalism for everyone else"
    Quote Originally Posted by Isyel View Post
    And btw, you're such a fucking asshole it genuinely amazes me on a regular basis how you manage to function.

  17. #13077
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    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    YOU WILL NOT GET BACK TO NORMAL BY PRETENDING THESE PEOPLE DONT EXIST
    You don't want to get back to normal, you need to redistribute wealth and opportunities in order to give these people a life that amounts to more than rotting away in a red state with nothing to do except watch fox news and racist youtubers.
    Look, the wages you withheld from the workmen who mowed your fields are crying out against you. The cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord of Hosts. You have lived on earth in luxury and self-indulgence. You have fattened yourselves for slaughter.

  18. #13078

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    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    you don't go for, for example, instantly enact free healthcare for all. you start small, and you slowly keep adding to it until there's essentially no difference between what you do, and free healthcare. most importantly, you work to take the heat out of the conversation.
    lol im glad you know a lot about American politics

    We did exactly what you described with healthcare, the baby steps incremental ACA where we tweak private insurance to expand coverage and try to find common ground with Republicans by using their plan from the Heritage Foundation. It was fucking despised for good reason.

    Try reading about American politics for a change, I'd start with A Crisis Wasted if you want to understand why your politics is DOA in the US
    White boomers and other fascists will never accept "healthcare for all" unless it excludes niggers, wetbacks, perverts, immigrants, freaks, "millenials" and other untermensch. They have both plainly said and repeatedly demonstrated that they'd rather die themselves than let the government provide support for the above mentioned.

    'Centrism' in US terms is "democratic socialism for the white right, oligarchal syndicalism for everyone else"
    I hadn't planned to really participate much more before the election, since I'm a bit burned out (not just on the election, but personally, life is quite challenging right now), but I felt the need to say this:

    I'm uncomfortable with how flippant you are with use of the bolded epithets in casual discourse. Even if it's an effort at criticism, I don't think it's appropriate for you to say them. It's not necessary to make your point.

    I mean this as a "friend", or whatever we are here at FHC Malc. I'd really suggest being less willing to use the words in public discourse.


  19. #13079
    Jack Coutu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    you don't go for, for example, instantly enact free healthcare for all. you start small, and you slowly keep adding to it until there's essentially no difference between what you do, and free healthcare. most importantly, you work to take the heat out of the conversation.
    lol im glad you know a lot about American politics

    We did exactly what you described with healthcare, the baby steps incremental ACA where we tweak private insurance to expand coverage and try to find common ground with Republicans by using their plan from the Heritage Foundation. It was fucking despised for good reason.

    Try reading about American politics for a change, I'd start with A Crisis Wasted if you want to understand why your politics is DOA in the US
    White boomers and other fascists will never accept "healthcare for all" unless it excludes niggers, wetbacks, perverts, immigrants, freaks, "millenials" and other untermensch. They have both plainly said and repeatedly demonstrated that they'd rather die themselves than let the government provide support for the above mentioned.

    'Centrism' in US terms is "democratic socialism for the white right, oligarchal syndicalism for everyone else"
    I hadn't planned to really participate much more before the election, since I'm a bit burned out (not just on the election, but personally, life is quite challenging right now), but I felt the need to say this:

    I'm uncomfortable with how flippant you are with use of the bolded epithets in casual discourse. Even if it's an effort at criticism, I don't think it's appropriate for you to say them. It's not necessary to make your point.

    I mean this as a "friend", or whatever we are here at FHC Malc. I'd really suggest being less willing to use the words in public discourse.
    We all knew you'd be back. Sorry to hear you're stressed, hopefully you can take a few days more after this m8.


    Also yeah, I mean we all know those words, no one really needs you saying them, everyone but Marlona knows thats what Marlona calls all the people he hates.

  20. #13080
    Movember '11 Best Facial Hair, Best 'Tache Movember 2011Movember 2012Donor helgur's Avatar
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