Ukraine: Russian Invasion

[rufuske]

This is sick.

It was very clear the Russians are waging a war of annihilation and will not be treated nicely if caught. And they know it.

Russia...

[rufuske]

This is sick.

It was very clear the Russians are waging a war of annihilation and will not be treated nicely if caught. And they know it.

Russia...

Maybe there's still some hope for Germany:
https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/com...lly_in_berlin/

[Nordstern]

but if there is no one doing fence sitting and both sides bullshit what will society do!?

Create an equitable society where peoples' lives and time are valued?

[rufuske]

but if there is no one doing fence sitting and both sides bullshit what will society do!?

Create an equitable society where peoples' lives and time are valued?

That's the dream.

[Maximillian]

There is a huge difference between acts committed by individuals and acts committed as part of a Government's policies. I am sure that individual Ukrainian soldiers are taking out their anger on Russians - I have heard but not seen evidence that as Russian soldiers like to shoot Ukrainians in the knees to cripple them that Ukrainians have shot captured Russian artillery men in the knees in return.

The difference being that we have radio intercepts where the Russians are talking about what they are doing with higher-ups. You don't have any of that from the Ukrainian side. Given the tidalwave of lies coming from Russia you also have to look at any footage of Ukrianians committing attrocities with scepticism as it is easy to put on uniforms of the enemy and shoot a few deserters. By comparison we have drone and satelite footage showing civilians being killed and bodies lying in the streets during the Russian occupation.

Also the Ukrainians will not have the trust in the concept that international law will bring the prepertrators to justice because that never happened when it came to the Soviets. Nuremburg and to a lesser degree the Tokyo trials are unique smiply because an occupying power was able to impose justice on those they had defeated. That was exceptionally rare in the 20th Century and most dictators and tyrants and their minions were never brought to justice for the tens of millions of deaths and endless suffering they caused. Ukraine saw that no one was punished for the starvation, executions, deportations, theft and slavery inflicted on them by the Soviets. And they will also realise that even if they win and drive every last Russian soldier off Ukrainian soil it is unlikely that those who committed the many crimes will ever be brought to account.

[indi]

There is a huge difference between acts committed by individuals and acts committed as part of a Government's policies.

Entirely true. I am not inclined to believe the Ukrainian government is using war crimes a part of its policy, and there is enough evidence Russia is. It's also sadly not very surprising on Russia's part, considering the past decade (MH17, Navalny and other suppression of opposition, novichok used on foreign soil, etc. etc.) Ukraine on the other hand has been struggling since Maidan to go the other way.

But: a word of warning. Our sources on this war are mostly Ukrainian and they do know very well how to wage the information war. You can't know this for a fact, so exercise some caution. Lief was right, war is fucking ugly and you can't know what it's like on the ground without actually being there.

PS I too have my doubts anyone will be tried. I still hope for that, however.

[Redmoore]

This channel has some very interesting summaries , very facts based of the war https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCC3...Gntmx3Q/videos

and another Aussie channel https://www.youtube.com/c/PosadistPacman/videos also a few interesting videos

[Lief Siddhe]

When gamers do better analyses than "professional" news companies Perun's got a good head on his shoulder.

[Candy Crush]

There is a huge difference between acts committed by individuals and acts committed as part of a Government's policies. I am sure that individual Ukrainian soldiers are taking out their anger on Russians - I have heard but not seen evidence that as Russian soldiers like to shoot Ukrainians in the knees to cripple them that Ukrainians have shot captured Russian artillery men in the knees in return.

The difference being that we have radio intercepts where the Russians are talking about what they are doing with higher-ups. You don't have any of that from the Ukrainian side. Given the tidalwave of lies coming from Russia you also have to look at any footage of Ukrianians committing attrocities with scepticism as it is easy to put on uniforms of the enemy and shoot a few deserters. By comparison we have drone and satelite footage showing civilians being killed and bodies lying in the streets during the Russian occupation.

Also the Ukrainians will not have the trust in the concept that international law will bring the prepertrators to justice because that never happened when it came to the Soviets. Nuremburg and to a lesser degree the Tokyo trials are unique smiply because an occupying power was able to impose justice on those they had defeated. That was exceptionally rare in the 20th Century and most dictators and tyrants and their minions were never brought to justice for the tens of millions of deaths and endless suffering they caused. Ukraine saw that no one was punished for the starvation, executions, deportations, theft and slavery inflicted on them by the Soviets. And they will also realise that even if they win and drive every last Russian soldier off Ukrainian soil it is unlikely that those who committed the many crimes will ever be brought to account.

These are heroic deeds!

[theBlind]

There is a huge difference between acts committed by individuals and acts committed as part of a Government's policies. I am sure that individual Ukrainian soldiers are taking out their anger on Russians - I have heard but not seen evidence that as Russian soldiers like to shoot Ukrainians in the knees to cripple them that Ukrainians have shot captured Russian artillery men in the knees in return.

The difference being that we have radio intercepts where the Russians are talking about what they are doing with higher-ups. You don't have any of that from the Ukrainian side. Given the tidalwave of lies coming from Russia you also have to look at any footage of Ukrianians committing attrocities with scepticism as it is easy to put on uniforms of the enemy and shoot a few deserters. By comparison we have drone and satelite footage showing civilians being killed and bodies lying in the streets during the Russian occupation.

Also the Ukrainians will not have the trust in the concept that international law will bring the prepertrators to justice because that never happened when it came to the Soviets. Nuremburg and to a lesser degree the Tokyo trials are unique smiply because an occupying power was able to impose justice on those they had defeated. That was exceptionally rare in the 20th Century and most dictators and tyrants and their minions were never brought to justice for the tens of millions of deaths and endless suffering they caused. Ukraine saw that no one was punished for the starvation, executions, deportations, theft and slavery inflicted on them by the Soviets. And they will also realise that even if they win and drive every last Russian soldier off Ukrainian soil it is unlikely that those who committed the many crimes will ever be brought to account.

These are heroic deeds!

Work on your reading comprehension.

[Lief Siddhe]

It's Candy Crush. Don't expect too much.

[Redmoore]

When gamers do better analyses than "professional" news companies Perun's got a good head on his shoulder.

In his latest video he says he has had a big uptake in views and subs since he has been doing his Ukraine stuff. And he is going to split his channel moving all the gaming stuff to a new channel.

[Spartan Dax]

When gamers do better analyses than "professional" news companies Perun's got a good head on his shoulder.

In his latest video he says he has had a big uptake in views and subs since he has been doing his Ukraine stuff. And he is going to split his channel moving all the gaming stuff to a new channel.

Found his channel while looking for some Phoenix point content some time ago and noted that most of his videos are about resource management. I can't say I disagree with him when it comes to those expensive wunderwaffe projects the russians are throwing money at.

[VARRAKK]

[Malcanis]

I hope they're not placing overmuch reliance on Johnson's promises.

Can't remember if it was mentioned in this thread already, but Sweden and Finland are going full steam ahead with joining NATO now.

[Steckersaurus]

I hope they're not placing overmuch reliance on Johnson's promises.

Can't remember if it was mentioned in this thread already, but Sweden and Finland are going full steam ahead with joining NATO now.

And Russia keeps threatening that they'll face the same fate as Ukraine if they do, which is a hilariously empty threat. They're struggling like this in Ukraine, there's no way in hell they can touch Finland.

[Candy Crush]

Work on your reading comprehension.

What we believe is wrong and war crimes, they believe rape, murder and robber are part and parcel of special operation's heroic deeds.

[Spartan Dax]

I hope they're not placing overmuch reliance on Johnson's promises.

Can't remember if it was mentioned in this thread already, but Sweden and Finland are going full steam ahead with joining NATO now.

I'm not surprised by Finlands rapid pace, they were always a pragmastic bunch when it comes to their noisy neighbour. Sweden OTOH, I raised more than an eybrow when our Social democratic Prime Minister said "neutrality has served us well". There's a lot of work being done in all the parties atm preparing their members for a NATO membership application and I think it will be sent in well before the election early september. The social democrats really doesn't want this to become an election issue.

The only reason this is possible is thanks to Putins decision to invade Ukraine. It was unthinkable even just 6 weeks ago.

[Malcanis]

I hope they're not placing overmuch reliance on Johnson's promises.

Can't remember if it was mentioned in this thread already, but Sweden and Finland are going full steam ahead with joining NATO now.

I'm not surprised by Finlands rapid pace, they were always a pragmastic bunch when it comes to their noisy neighbour. Sweden OTOH, I raised more than an eybrow when our Social democratic Prime Minister said "neutrality has served us well". There's a lot of work being done in all the parties atm preparing their members for a NATO membership application and I think it will be sent in well before the election early september. The social democrats really doesn't want this to become an election issue.

The only reason this is possible is thanks to Putins decision to invade Ukraine. It was unthinkable even just 6 weeks ago.

Well yeah the old deal was 'Stay sorta kinda neutral and there won't be any trouble from Russia'

Now that deal is most clearly and evidently off. If I were Finnish or Swedish I would not be valuing Russia's promises and deals as worth shit. The deal is now "There WILL be trouble, sooner or later." I'm sure that most Swedes don't view being in NATO with any huge enthusiasm, but it sure as shit beats being in or next to the New Rus Reich.

[Lief Siddhe]

about the thingy that crashed into Zagreb three weeks ago